Bitshares DEX Telegram History

Ammar Yousef23:43:37 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Getting executed in a loop

Ammar Yousef23:43:43 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

In particular block

Ammar Yousef23:43:55 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

That’s how I see it

Z Rex23:44:11 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

AmmarYousef

Getting executed in a loop

bug right after GS eh. how did that go down?

Omar23:44:44 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if someone did this in order for everyone not to be liquidated it's not so bad 😂

🤞

Alex M - clockwork23:45:03 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

AmmarYousef

That’s how I see it

Ammar Yousef23:45:18 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

The API is flooded with something has misconfiguration for particular execution timeout

Z Rex23:45:36 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

how is this not a pinned message on the progress?

Cryptick Cryptick23:45:55 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nonoiz

bug right after GS eh. how did that go down?

It could be a bug with a settling order.... (in which case it would only be natural to happen after a settlement).

Ammar Yousef23:46:00 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

API database*

Alex M - clockwork23:46:13 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptick1

It could be a bug with a settling order.... (in which case it would only be natural to happen after a settlement).

warmer ;)

Cryptick Cryptick23:46:48 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

warmer ;)

Cool. And I am sorta completely clueless....

Z Rex23:48:25 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

warmer ;)

again, y no updates/announcments anywhere?

Alex M - clockwork23:49:18 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Block Production halted due to a bug. Patch in progress

Alex M - clockwork23:49:23 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

is that better?

Z Rex23:50:07 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

there ya go. 👍 whats a time frame on completion?

Z Rex23:50:37 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

is that better?

can we maybe get a tweet too? 😉

Alex M - clockwork23:50:57 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

twitter is community ran

Alex M - clockwork23:51:01 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

no idea who runs it

Ammar Yousef23:53:18 - 26 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

Block Production halted due to a bug. Patch in progress

Is this bug related to API requests misbehaving?

Cristian Ortiz00:04:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

News and results in the world of trading. 💰📊 Wolf Investor 🔥✅ https://t.me/WolfInvestor

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)00:16:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Implement the fix when the markets go up again... That's how you deal with a GS threat

George Samuel crypto boss00:19:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

FarmerD

Please don't sell or buy btc on telegram. Use an exchange

How can someone in India purchase bitcoins, since it's illegal there... I have a friend over there who really wants to buy

octomatic00:19:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Samuel_George

How can someone in India purchase bitcoins, since it's illegal there... I have a friend over there who really wants to buy

localbitcoins still operating

George Samuel crypto boss00:20:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

octomatic

localbitcoins still operating

Can I dm you?... Please explain better to me

octomatic00:21:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

sure

George Samuel crypto boss00:22:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

octomatic

sure

I'm unable to send you a dm, just tried but said you not on my contact

octomatic00:23:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

dm'd you

Alex M - clockwork00:23:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

UPDATE: Block Production Resumed. Chain is operational. UI might be unresponsive till API nodes are patched.

George (Bitspark)00:25:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

UPDATE: Block Production Resumed. Chain is operational. UI might be unresponsive till API nodes are patched.

where is the patch?

George (Bitspark)00:26:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

on bitshares-core github repo?

Dexy Bitshares00:26:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

George_Bitspark

where is the patch?

https://github.com/bitshares/bitshares-core/commit/e3e5cc3a422675e3dc289664a019a4cc2435b5fb

Alex M - clockwork00:27:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yeah but better wait for official instructions in bitshares node admins

R00:31:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

UPDATE: Block Production Resumed. Chain is operational. UI might be unresponsive till API nodes are patched.

Nice one 👍

Dino Devon00:38:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

Implement the fix when the markets go up again... That's how you deal with a GS threat

my thoughts exactly

fractalnode00:41:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

http://gifgifmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/macka-daj-pet-jea.gif

Miguelpt00:44:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

UPDATE: Block Production Resumed. Chain is operational. UI might be unresponsive till API nodes are patched.

can you give me a detailed explaination about what was the issue pls ?

Alex M - clockwork00:44:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Miguelpt

can you give me a detailed explaination about what was the issue pls ?

core team will release a full report..

Miguelpt00:45:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

core team will release a full report..

thank you. i will be waiting for that. pls pin it here!

Kings01:15:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

chance for bitUSD to get on Binance - https://steemit.com/steem/@kingscrown/binance-will-change-usdt-market-to-combined-stablecoin-market-chance-for-bitshares-and-steem

Ronny Boesing01:23:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Well now We need wait since bitUSD was global settled

patinity01:28:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

danger

George (Bitspark)01:28:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

kingskingsking

chance for bitUSD to get on Binance - https://steemit.com/steem/@kingscrown/binance-will-change-usdt-market-to-combined-stablecoin-market-chance-for-bitshares-and-steem

not unless bitUSD gets out of global settlement

patinity01:29:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

George_Bitspark

not unless bitUSD gets out of global settlement

panic not much

Virtual Growth01:48:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

👋🏻🙏

nahu02:12:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

UPDATE: Block Production Resumed. Chain is operational. UI might be unresponsive till API nodes are patched.

right, but we need to wait for a few more witnesses to patch/produce before consensus is restored and LIB starts moving again

Z Rex02:15:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Miguelpt

thank you. i will be waiting for that. pls pin it here!

👍

Kings03:14:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

keep getting init-error

Kings03:14:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

but im connected to nodes

Kings03:14:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ideas?

Raf Raf03:14:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hi are there still a problems?

Ryan Josh Altman03:15:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hello good mates, Bitcoins needed at a large amount for sales purposes and long term holding by a company. Mediators get their commission. Strictly escrow safe and secure system for transactions or f2f

Raf Raf03:15:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I don’t see my transaction in Bts explorer

nahu03:16:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

consensus recovered, we are back

Raf Raf03:17:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Didn’t received funds for more than 30 minutes

Luke Stokes03:45:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I was hunting around to find more info about the global settlement (it's not even mentioned in the bitshares docs about how margins work) and found this. Others may find it helpful as well: https://steemit.com/bitshares/@haruka/detailed-mechanism-of-global-settlement-black-swan-and-reviving-of-bitassets

Jeff03:48:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Great work and thank you to the dev team!

Ryan R. Fox (BitShares Core)04:18:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

All validation nodes need to update at this time. The block producing nodes are updated and the last irreversible block is advancing. A full description of the incident and its resolution will be provided by the Core Team within 12 hours. Release 2.0.181127 https://github.com/bitshares/bitshares-core/releases

Mathew04:23:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ryanRfox

Thanks Ryan - what a f*cking crazy week. Look forward to hearing the details.

Pablo Tutino04:26:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hi! Is it mandatory for everyone to upgrade the node to version `BitShares Core Release 2.0.181127`?

FarmerD04:36:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

UPDATE: Block Production Resumed. Chain is operational. UI might be unresponsive till API nodes are patched.

Any estimate update of when API nodes will be patched?

Virtual Growth04:40:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ryanRfox

🙏

は

はるか04:43:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

dargonar

Hi! Is it mandatory for everyone to upgrade the node to version BitShares Core Release 2.0.181127?

yes, else your node will still stuck at that position

Pablo Tutino04:44:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Thank you!

は

はるか04:44:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

API nodes need to go through a full replay, so it depends on their machine

は

はるか04:46:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

seems like input of nano-bot caused this...?

Valera Cogut04:47:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yes right my account

Valera Cogut04:47:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

my transaction was

Valera Cogut04:47:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you will get official report from Core Team soon

は

はるか04:48:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I think I already get all details from blockchain data...

Valera Cogut04:51:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yes and from github also if you know what to look

は

はるか04:51:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yep

Valera Cogut04:51:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

👍

は

はるか04:52:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

failed assert on db maintenance is always catastrophic...

nahu04:53:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

dargonar

Hi! Is it mandatory for everyone to upgrade the node to version BitShares Core Release 2.0.181127?

hola Pablo, rnglab por aca. I've first applied this patch on top of one of my api nodes to reduce downtime, as it doesn't require replay (works for version 181120 or higher I guess) `e3e5cc3a422675e3dc289664a019a4cc2435b5fb`, while upgrading and replaying my other api nodes

Playtronics One04:55:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

the BitShares Core Release 2.0.181127 Windows 64 version does not seem to work, where do I report this problem and get tech support?

George (Bitspark)05:02:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

valeracogut

yes right my account

😄

Alex M - clockwork05:50:39 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Playtronics

the BitShares Core Release 2.0.181127 Windows 64 version does not seem to work, where do I report this problem and get tech support?

https://github.com/bitshares/bitshares-core/issues

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)05:51:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Just woke up, seed and witness synchronized with latest patch

Virtual Growth06:01:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

Just woke up, seed and witness synchronized with latest patch

👍🙏

Alex M - clockwork06:19:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

When it rains it pours

George (Bitspark)07:48:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

back to normal now, anyway bitCNY 1.12

Omar08:56:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

No bts whales in sight

OLA08:58:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

2 ways to triple up your btc

nutela09:05:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Good work peeps!

mary Damian09:11:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Paying company www.abacusinvest.net

mary Damian09:12:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Paying company www.abacusinvest.net

Crypto Kong09:13:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

With regards to the bidding process on bitUSD. Am i right in thinking you contribute BTS in order to push the collateral level up to 1.75 and once it gets there you take on a share of the debt but you will end up with your contributed collateral plus collateral from the gs pool?

Stefan09:14:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Basically you are offering the 75% and get the 100% form the settlement fund

Alex M - clockwork09:14:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

yes

Alex M - clockwork09:14:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

in a perfectly ideal world

Crypto Kong09:14:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ok cool

Alex M - clockwork09:14:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

everyone would bid the required collateral for their previous debt

Alex M - clockwork09:15:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and asset is revived with everyone holding theire pevious positions properly collateralised

Alex M - clockwork09:15:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

as if they had added collateral up to 1.75 prior to GS

Alex M - clockwork09:15:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

this is not an ideal world :P

Crypto Kong09:15:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

everyone would bid the required collateral for their previous debt

Can you bid more/ less and receive a greater/larger share of the debt? Or are you limited by your previous debt?

nutela09:15:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

At what price Alex?

Crypto Kong09:16:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

At what price Alex?

Theres no price

Alex M - clockwork09:16:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

feed price

Crypto Kong09:16:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Your just adding collateral

Alex M - clockwork09:16:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

@Cryptokong123 he's right....gotta have a price to calculate 1.75 against

nutela09:16:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

feed price

Oh but the feed price now is lower than GS price

Crypto Kong09:17:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ah right sorry i misunderstood the question

Alex M - clockwork09:17:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Oh but the feed price now is lower than GS price

yes...that means slightly more collateral would be needed

nutela09:17:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So that’s actually a good deal, but I didn’t have coffee so...

Alex M - clockwork09:17:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i just presented an exampel locked in tiem to explain how it works

nutela09:17:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Right, thanks Alex!

Alex M - clockwork09:17:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

actually when price rises it's a better deal

Alex M - clockwork09:17:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you add less than 75%

Alex M - clockwork09:18:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and get a fully collateralised position in the process

nutela09:18:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Yeah I was thinking to just buy BTS

Crypto Kong09:18:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So in your example alex

Crypto Kong09:19:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We could close the position and basically profit from the gs pool collateral

Alex M - clockwork09:19:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yes....

Alex M - clockwork09:20:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if BTS price rises , i expect to see many collateral bids

Stefan09:20:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Profit only in the sense that you can open a 175% position by only bidding 75%, so you can get bigger positions with less BTS

Alex M - clockwork09:20:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

sschiessl

Profit only in the sense that you can open a 175% position by only bidding 75%, so you can get bigger positions with less BTS

depends...imagine if BTS price rises to a hair below revival

Alex M - clockwork09:20:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you bid 1 BTS for 7.5m debt :P

nutela09:20:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So if I’d buy BTS I can’t sell it for bitUSD right now?

Alex M - clockwork09:21:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and the equivalent collateral

Alex M - clockwork09:21:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

So if I’d buy BTS I can’t sell it for bitUSD right now?

you can

Stefan09:21:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

you bid 1 BTS for 7.5m debt :P

If you bid 0.75 BTS, you will get a position with 1.75 BTS as collateral

Alex M - clockwork09:22:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

sschiessl

If you bid 0.75 BTS, you will get a position with 1.75 BTS as collateral

i think position health is calculated at feed price

Alex M - clockwork09:22:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

imagine we have 10 bts/bitUSD settlement

Alex M - clockwork09:22:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

10 bitUSD total debt

Alex M - clockwork09:22:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

100 bts in settlement fund

Stefan09:23:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hm, I suppose I should read BSIP18 to the full extent first 😊 and possibly look in the code

Alex M - clockwork09:23:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

now say price rises so that 100 bts is enough to collateralize 10 bitUSD debt up to 1.7499999999999999

Raf Raf09:23:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hi I still doesn’t received funds on binanace

Alex M - clockwork09:23:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you bid 1 BTS

Alex M - clockwork09:23:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

for teh 10 USD debt

Raf Raf09:24:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Block explore show my transaction . Where is the problems ?

Stefan09:24:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Rafradio

Block explore show my transaction . Where is the problems ?

Please ask binance if its a deposit into binance

Alex M - clockwork09:24:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Rafradio

Block explore show my transaction . Where is the problems ?

there was a blockchain bug last night

nutela09:24:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

now say price rises so that 100 bts is enough to collateralize 10 bitUSD debt up to 1.7499999999999999

You are saying you get 75% for free?

Alex M - clockwork09:24:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

they might not have upgraded their nodes yet

Alex M - clockwork09:24:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

You are saying you get 75% for free?

i *THINK*

Alex M - clockwork09:25:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

unless it's always counted at settlement price

Alex M - clockwork09:25:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and when feed price kicks in after revival you end up with overcollateralised positions

nutela09:25:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

But if all the excess collateral was given back, it’s free money

Alex M - clockwork09:25:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

But if all the excess collateral was given back, it’s free money

debt is given as well

Fabian Schuh09:25:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

when you bid for settlement funds, you don't get anything "for free" ..

Fabian Schuh09:26:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you get a potentially bigger position immediately, and don't need to look for buyers of your bitUSD ..

nutela09:26:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

debt is given as well

I don’t get that?

Fabian Schuh09:26:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

because the debt is already out there

Alex M - clockwork09:26:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

when you bid for settlement funds, you don't get anything "for free" ..

still...when calculating for revival...does it use feed or settlement price?

nutela09:26:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ah right I think I get it

nutela09:27:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So I’m right in saying it’s cheaper to just buy BTS at this lower price than GS?

Fabian Schuh09:27:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if BTS was 0.01$, then, in GS, every bitUSD would be backed by 100BTS ..

Alex M - clockwork09:27:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i.e. in teh exampel above...would i always have to bid 75 BTS? regardless of feed price? or is my assumption that at high enough BTS price , just 1 BTS might get you the proper leverage

nutela09:27:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Why would I want to buy debt when the price could fall even lower?

Fabian Schuh09:27:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if you bid for 1 bitUSD, you provide additioanl 75 BTS and end up with 1 bitUSD debt and 175 BTS in collateal

Alex M - clockwork09:27:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Why would I want to buy debt when the price could fall even lower?

why would you ever margin then?

Fabian Schuh09:27:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bidding is independent of feed price

Alex M - clockwork09:27:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

the price can ALWAYS fall lower

nutela09:28:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

why would you ever margin then?

Yeah exactly that was what I was thinking

Alex M - clockwork09:28:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Yeah exactly that was what I was thinking

others dont feel the same way :)

nutela09:28:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I was still missing my stockpile of BTS I bought :))

Alex M - clockwork09:28:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

bidding is independent of feed price

hmm

Fabian Schuh09:29:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

well ..

Alex M - clockwork09:29:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

so even if the settlement fund is enough to almost completely 1.75 collateralize teh debt

nutela09:29:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

if you bid for 1 bitUSD, you provide additioanl 75 BTS and end up with 1 bitUSD debt and 175 BTS in collateal

This is like creating new debt though..

Alex M - clockwork09:29:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

because the price has risen

Alex M - clockwork09:29:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i still need to bid 7% settlement fund?

Fabian Schuh09:29:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

This is like creating new debt though..

nop .. you "take over" existing debt

Fabian Schuh09:29:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

i still need to bid 75% settlement fund?

you're right .. bidding does depend on feed price ..

nutela09:29:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

nop .. you "take over" existing debt

Aha ok… I thought all debt was sold in GS?

Fabian Schuh09:29:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if BTS rises, you an bid less to get the same effect

Alex M - clockwork09:30:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

so if you time it right....you COULD get the entire position for a few bts

Fabian Schuh09:30:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Aha ok… I thought all debt was sold through GS?

NOOOO!

Alex M - clockwork09:30:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

assumign no competition

Fabian Schuh09:30:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

debt is not sold in GS .. bitUSD are still there .. untouched

Fabian Schuh09:30:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

backed by the settlement fund

Fabian Schuh09:30:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

read this: https://steemit.com/bitshares/@bitshares.fdn/how-global-settlements-work

nutela09:30:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

read this: https://steemit.com/bitshares/@bitshares.fdn/how-global-settlements-work

Thanks, I will right now

nutela09:32:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

“short squeeze protection ratio” = MSSR (1.1 in this case)

nutela09:33:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

“Collateral is aggregated in the so called settlement fund which now holds all BTS to back outstanding bitAsset with 100% ratio.” But the GS price was higher than the current price feed/

Fabian Schuh09:33:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

correct

nutela09:33:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So you should get cheaper bitUSD then

Fabian Schuh09:34:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

what is "price feed" for you?

nutela09:34:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

what is "price feed" for you?

Current price

Fabian Schuh09:34:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

due to BSIP42, the price feed did not reflect actual pricing of BTS ..

Mathew09:34:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

read this: https://steemit.com/bitshares/@bitshares.fdn/how-global-settlements-work

Read this a few days back and it cleared a few things up. Effectively it's global settlement of debt, not global settlement of bitUSD.

Fabian Schuh09:35:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

Read this a few days back and it cleared a few things up. Effectively it's global settlement of debt, not global settlement of bitUSD.

well .. debt = bitUSD

nutela09:35:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

Read this a few days back and it cleared a few things up. Effectively it's global settlement of debt, not global settlement of bitUSD.

Exactly “Effectively it's global settlement of debt, not global settlement of bitUSD."

Fabian Schuh09:35:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

the collateral is settled :D

nutela09:35:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Right

Fabian Schuh09:35:39 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if you borro, you owe bitusd to the blockchain, hence bitUSD=debt, BTS=collateral

Fabian Schuh09:35:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

guess that's where the misundertanding came from :D

nutela09:35:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So like Alex said if I add 75% I get back my collateral “Collateral is aggregated in the so called settlement fund which now holds all BTS to back outstanding bitAsset with 100% ratio.”

nutela09:37:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

But at current price < GS settlement it’s actually more expensive? do buy the required 75% of BTS

nutela09:44:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

If BTS was 2 cents, but GS was 5 cents, adding 75% of 2 cents cost me 50*3/4=37.5 when 1 bitUSD had given me 20 BTS back…

nutela09:45:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hence I hope I’m correct in thinking it’s cheaper to buy BTS now at a discount.

nutela09:46:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Please correct me if I’m wrong, like Jeff Berwick says I went to public school so I can’t count 🤞

nutela09:46:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

God I hated that school...

Fabian Schuh09:49:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

buying BTS is different from margin on bitUSD ..

nutela09:50:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

buying BTS is different from margin on bitUSD ..

Yes, I’m thinking out loud here.

Fabian Schuh09:50:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

👍

nutela09:52:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

“The settlement fund and corresponding loans are auctioned sufficiently to cover the minimum collateral ratio. When that happens, the bitAsset will be re-enabled in a subsequent maintenance window.” minimum collateral ratio = 100% in this case? https://steemit.com/bitshares/@bitshares.fdn/how-global-settlements-work

Alex M - clockwork09:52:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

175%

Alex M - clockwork09:52:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

or whatever witnesses are feeding

Dominic09:52:39 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Guys and girls - I'm doing research and want to gauge community sentiment. It been widely discussed that BitShares lacks a strategic marketing effort. As marketing is a broad term, and BitShares is a multi-faceted ecosystem, where would you like to see marketing efforts directed? Tell me here: https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/GCVQGX8 #marketingpoll

Muhammad Noman09:52:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=334381407386098&id=100024427245756

nutela09:52:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

or whatever witnesses are feeding

OK thanks 👍

Muhammad Noman09:53:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=334381407386098&id=100024427245756

Alex M - clockwork09:53:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

technically witnesses could feed a lower MCR to revive the asset faster

Alex M - clockwork09:53:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and bring it up slowly afterwards

Alex M - clockwork09:53:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

probably not a good idea though

nutela09:53:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

But that could be quite risky

nutela09:54:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Let’s first fix BSIP42 IMHO

Alex M - clockwork09:54:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

agreed

Alex M - clockwork09:54:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

my opinion is that we didnt allow it to work freely

Alex M - clockwork09:54:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and proetcted shorters in teh downtrend

Alex M - clockwork09:54:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

seeing as they wouldve been called faster and for more

Alex M - clockwork09:54:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

but that was supposed to be the intended effect

nutela09:55:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

and proetcted shorters in teh downtrend

I agree

Alex M - clockwork09:55:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

by protecting them, we broke the initial premise

nutela09:55:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Indeed

nutela09:55:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

seeing as they wouldve been called faster and for more

Not sure why they weren’t..

Alex M - clockwork09:55:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i believe it would ve performed much better and on par to no manipulation if allowed to work freeky

Alex M - clockwork09:55:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

freely

Alex M - clockwork09:56:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

peopel woudl still eb upset at getting liquidated with minimal market price variatiosn though

Alex M - clockwork09:56:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

(if their CR wasnt very conservative)

nutela09:56:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

peopel woudl still eb upset at getting liquidated with minimal market price variatiosn though

True… but then don’t be close to the bleeding edge

Alex M - clockwork09:56:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

my opinion too

nutela09:57:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Maybe there could be a checbox “automatic add more collateral” and notify me… via email?

Alex M - clockwork09:57:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

technicall there is a target CR option

nutela09:57:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

That would be awesome!

Jenny Kim09:57:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hello everyone here

nutela10:03:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

How does the bidding work? https://steemit.com/bitshares/@bitshares.fdn/how-global-settlements-work#@markopaasila/re-vvk-re-markopaasila-re-bitsharesfdn-how-global-settlements-work-20181126t190630844z

Crypto Kong10:04:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

sschiessl

Profit only in the sense that you can open a 175% position by only bidding 75%, so you can get bigger positions with less BTS

Yes exactly 👍

nutela10:05:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

https://steemit.com/bitshares/@bitshares.fdn/how-global-settlements-work#@markopaasila/re-vvk-re-markopaasila-re-bitsharesfdn-how-global-

Stefan10:06:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

dom_ahdigital

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)10:11:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

by protecting them, we broke the initial premise

THIS ^^^ 10% is to low to give enough insetives to speculators to try to break some shorters for profit... Optimally MSSR should be high as possible, specially on markets with high volumes..

Georgy10:13:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we're going to witness bitcny GS, anyone excited ?

Alex M - clockwork10:14:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ironandcopper

we're going to witness bitcny GS, is anyone excited ?

we're not

Georgy10:14:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

😂

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)10:16:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

It's obvious big players want it to happen... I don't buy it that they don't have funds to increase their collateral... It is a zero sum game... So the losses will get profits for others...

Alex M - clockwork10:17:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

It's obvious big players want it to happen... I don't buy it that they don't have funds to increase their collateral... It is a zero sum game... So the losses will get profits for others...

not true

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)10:17:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Why?

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)10:19:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

"Big players" could be competitors as well, don't take me wrong

R10:21:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

Why?

Technically the least collateralized position could be a small user, not a whale

Stefan10:21:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bitUSD it was gamma-rabbit wasn't it?

Alex M - clockwork10:21:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

judging by talks in forums and groups etc....they do not want it to happen at all

Alex M - clockwork10:22:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

others might....but the ones that can avoid it, woudl if they could

Valera Cogut10:22:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Technically the least collateralized position could be a small user, not a whale

absolutely right

nutela10:23:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

😢

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)10:23:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So we could have many small users that hate bts (competitors) and don't take care for their collateral in purpose... Seems like a nice and easy attack....

Alex M - clockwork10:24:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

So we could have many small users that hate bts (competitors) and don't take care for their collateral in purpose... Seems like a nice and easy attack....

thats a very distinct possibility actually

Alex M - clockwork10:24:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

never saw it in bitusd

Slavi La Libertad10:24:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

😢

Still a lucky man. :)

Alex M - clockwork10:24:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

but bitcny perhaps

R10:25:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

So we could have many small users that hate bts (competitors) and don't take care for their collateral in purpose... Seems like a nice and easy attack....

So buy their force settlement?

Alex M - clockwork10:25:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

So buy their force settlement?

24h delay though

Alex M - clockwork10:25:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

So buy their force settlement?

actually ricky...woudl love your input on this:

Alex M - clockwork10:25:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27459.0

nutela10:26:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

memset

Still a lucky man. :)

You don’t see how I bought @ 30 cents and 40 cents… 😂

Cryptomancer10:26:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

@xeroc looks like there's some problem with Bitshares node connections right now. I'm getting repeated errors trying to connect to wss://eu.nodes.bitshares.ws:

Cryptomancer10:26:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Handshake status 503 Service Unavailable Lost connection to node during rpcexec(): wss://eu.nodes.bitshares.ws (2/-1) Retrying in 2 seconds

R10:26:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

During these times the wp for getting smartcoins added to exchanges seems inappropriate lol

Alex M - clockwork10:26:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bt_cryptomancer

@xeroc looks like there's some problem with Bitshares node connections right now. I'm getting repeated errors trying to connect to wss://eu.nodes.bitshares.ws:

nodes being updated due to last nights bug

R10:26:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bt_cryptomancer

@xeroc looks like there's some problem with Bitshares node connections right now. I'm getting repeated errors trying to connect to wss://eu.nodes.bitshares.ws:

Nodes need to update

Alex M - clockwork10:26:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

During these times the wp for getting smartcoins added to exchanges seems inappropriate lol

why? we're JUST like tether now

Alex M - clockwork10:26:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptomancer10:26:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ok, I see. any ETA until the upgrade is complete?

Alex M - clockwork10:27:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bt_cryptomancer

ok, I see. any ETA until the upgrade is complete?

1-2 hrs i expect includign replay time...@xeroc will know more

Cryptomancer10:27:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ok, thanks for the info

nutela10:27:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27459.0

Alex that’s what I suggested yesterday and you went bonkers 😂

R10:27:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

why? we're JUST like tether now

Not hertz with its 1k supply 🤣

Slavi La Libertad10:27:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

During these times the wp for getting smartcoins added to exchanges seems inappropriate lol

Really. :)

Slavi La Libertad10:28:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hertz is on the top of stablecoins. 😉

Alex M - clockwork10:28:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Alex that’s what I suggested yesterday and you went bonkers 😂

i went bonkers cause you kept interrupting a conversation someone had to focus on to udnerstand the mechanics

Alex M - clockwork10:28:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

the forum post was made much earlier

nutela10:29:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

i went bonkers cause you kept interrupting a conversation someone had to focus on to udnerstand the mechanics

Mêh… I was just trying to point out a logical outcome.. but ok fair enough

Alex M - clockwork10:29:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Mêh… I was just trying to point out a logical outcome.. but ok fair enough

yeah but luke was really out of his depth with regards to the basic mechanics

nutela10:30:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

the forum post was made much earlier

I didn’t read it 😉

Alex M - clockwork10:30:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

need to get those before we bombard him with improvement information

nutela10:30:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

yeah but luke was really out of his depth with regards to the basic mechanics

Alex Luke runs a witness node, he’s smart as hell.

nutela10:30:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

need to get those before we bombard him with improvement information

OK fair enough 👍

nutela10:31:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Look all I care about is logic. No harsh feelings.

Alex M - clockwork10:31:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Alex Luke runs a witness node, he’s smart as hell.

steem...

nutela10:31:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

But yeah I should read more…

nutela10:31:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

steem...

Yes steem node

Alex M - clockwork10:31:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

no feeds, no smart assets , no margin mechanics

Alex M - clockwork10:31:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nada

Alex M - clockwork10:31:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

totally different thing

nutela10:32:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I know but do you know him?

Alex M - clockwork10:32:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

spoken to him a few times before

nutela10:32:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

He developed foxycart…

Alex M - clockwork10:32:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

smart has nothing to do with it

nutela10:32:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

He’s very active, also now on EOS...

nutela10:32:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

smart has nothing to do with it

OK I’ll give you enough questions then 😂

nutela10:33:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cheer up Alex 🤗

Fabian Schuh10:33:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bt_cryptomancer

ok, I see. any ETA until the upgrade is complete?

2hrs probably

nutela10:33:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

You sound as if you are not getting enough sleep!

R10:33:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27459.0

Makes sense being able to buy bad debt from someone. Irl, banks sell debt between one another all the time.

Crypto Kong10:34:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Makes sense being able to buy bad debt from someone. Irl, banks sell debt between one another all the time.

☝☝☝

Alex M - clockwork10:35:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

dude...i'm smart too, ive developed loads of thigns...i'm a witness here etc.

Crypto Kong10:35:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Meh

Crypto Kong10:35:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

😂

Alex M - clockwork10:35:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

doesnt mean i can understand ANY subject in secodns if not allowed to focus

nutela10:35:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

dude...i'm smart too, ive developed loads of thigns...i'm a witness here etc.

Of course you are, wouldn’t be talking to you if you weren’t 😏

nutela10:36:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

doesnt mean i can understand ANY subject in secodns if not allowed to focus

Same here.. can’t count under stress for example.

Crypto Kong10:36:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

🙈

nutela10:37:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We all need that 👆

Alex M - clockwork10:38:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Makes sense being able to buy bad debt from someone. Irl, banks sell debt between one another all the time.

its basically buying margin calls bypassing the order book

nutela10:39:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I think it’s a good idea like I said before. It reminds me of Kowala.. https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27459.msg325211#msg325211

R10:41:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

how are we doing with the GS price for bitcny?

R10:41:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

its basically buying margin calls bypassing the order book

Though, couldn't you just place buy orders at margin call prices?

R10:42:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ii can't access the exchange so i have no idea

Alex M - clockwork10:42:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Though, couldn't you just place buy orders at margin call prices?

you have to buy the order book up to margin call price

Alex M - clockwork10:42:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

its not a normal usage

Alex M - clockwork10:42:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

its for lack of liquidity and protecting your own position by lowering GS price

nutela10:47:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

TTYL guys

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)11:05:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Do you think witnesses would agree to raise MSSR to 20% after 24h for example so most would be informed?

JonnyB11:15:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I think mssr should be fixed at 20%

Alex M - clockwork11:15:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

I think mssr should be fixed at 20%

thign is ...20% is fine in a liquid market

Alex M - clockwork11:16:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

not so much in a low vol one

Alex M - clockwork11:16:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

fuck knows how we can get around that

JonnyB11:17:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mssr is just about making sure people maintain collateral

JonnyB11:18:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mssr at 20% is fine in an illiquid market

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)11:19:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

MSSR to 20% is very reasonable, it could get higher also , but let's raise it gradually

JonnyB11:19:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

More margin calls would have been bought if we had 20% mssr. Possibly preventing GS

Alex M - clockwork11:19:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

sure

Alex M - clockwork11:20:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

def fine for bitusd/bitcny

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)11:20:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nobody takes risk in crypto for 10% with so much volatility... 20% is the absolute minimum if you ask me

Alex M - clockwork11:20:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

it all comes doen to witnesses "judging" whats appropriate for each asset

JonnyB11:21:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

It should be a committee set parameter. (I know it's not)

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)11:23:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bytemaster was in favor to let it free from the beginning !

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)11:24:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

the problem was back then, that we had not volume enough etc..

Alex M - clockwork11:25:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

It should be a committee set parameter. (I know it's not)

nah...witness fed is better imho...it should be set epr market

Alex M - clockwork11:25:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

just need better witnesses :D

Alex M - clockwork11:26:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ive learned more about market economics last couple of months as a witness than I'd ever have

Alex M - clockwork11:26:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

wish everyone else did teh same

Slavi La Libertad11:30:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

nah...witness fed is better imho...it should be set epr market

It opens a gate for manipulations with feed prices... Like with bsip42... Hardcoded mssr could be a better. Or not in some cases. 😄

Mathew11:34:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

True… but then don’t be close to the bleeding edge

Agree. A lot of us closed our margin on the drop down, losing as we did so but recognising it was necessary. I think managed to lose another chunk by opening a margin near the (current) bottom even though I had a big collateral ratio and enough BTS to drop my call price to under 2 if needed. Oh well.

Mathew11:37:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

More margin calls would have been bought if we had 20% mssr. Possibly preventing GS

Agree with this as well. Too many of the solutions being suggested just protect margin holders - the real solution and the only one that will give us robust stablecoins is making sure margins are sold

Alex M - clockwork11:39:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

that can also cause the peg to get lost though

Mathew11:40:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

For anyone scratching their head MSSR etc I copied the below from a STEEMIT post which clarified for me: Throughout the example, MCR will be 1.75 and MSSR will be 1.1, i. e. you must provide at least 175% collateral, and margin calls will pay up to 10% above the market price.

Alex M - clockwork11:40:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

need to find a balnce

Mathew11:41:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

that can also cause the peg to get lost though

This is the argument we keep going back to but is it valid?

Alex M - clockwork11:41:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

This is the argument we keep going back to but is it valid?

yes

Mathew11:41:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

The actual bitUSD peg should be the fact you can settle at any time for that amount in BTS

Mathew11:41:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

If the market demands/pays a premium in up or down trends then is that the peg broken?

Alex M - clockwork11:41:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

its what bsip42 tried to coutner...but imho was too conservative on teh downtrend and overprotected shorters

Ole11:42:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Can anyone tell me the implications on bitUSD after this event? Is it very undafe to hold bitUSD?

Alex M - clockwork11:42:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ole

Can anyone tell me the implications on bitUSD after this event? Is it very undafe to hold bitUSD?

not really...

Mathew11:42:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

its what bsip42 tried to coutner...but imho was too conservative on teh downtrend and overprotected shorters

BSIP tried to protect margin holders and the peg at the expense of the system functioning as its meant to

Mathew11:42:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

It would have been ok if it came with a MSSR adjustment in my view

Ole11:43:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Alex, could you elaborate?

Mathew11:43:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Make the MSSR 1.2 as a minimum because feed price was ending up always 10% above the Dex price

Kathy Jameson11:43:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

🤔When will the bleeding stop?🤔 Hello everyone, The current price of Bitcoin is $3720, with roughly 6.3 billion in 24 hour volume. Bitcoin has dipped 20% further since our last update. The total market cap of crypto has shed nearly 90 billion USD in roughly 12 days, resulting in a 43% loss to the total market.📉 As of right now, we are still holding our low leverage shorts in order to achieve neutrality in terms of crypto exposure. This will allow us to maintain our buying power as crypto stabilizes or moves lower. Our goal now is to maintain as much of our capital as possible so that we can implement a dollar cost averaging strategy. Dollar Cost Averaging is achieved by simply formulating a plan to use predetermined percentages of one’s capital to buy at select prices. Our team will be utilizing this strategy because it is a more risk averse system for ‘catching the bottom’. We will release a more detailed DCA strategy this week. On lower time frames, we see an opportunity for $BTC to experience a mini rally from here to the $4300-4500 levels, but will wait for more consolidation before reducing our short exposure. (See Chart Below) At this point in time, it is clear that panic is gripping cryptocurrency investors and participants everywhere. Besides the extreme sell-off, there are reports of miners selling their rigs in mass quantities at a per/pound price. Every news outlet is seemingly covering the demise of crypto as prices continue to plunge. Does this mean crypto is truly dying? No! ❌ During Bitcoin’s ten year existence, the price of $BTC has suffered four bear markets that, in terms of percentage loss, were worse than the ongoing 2018 bear market. This is what is expected when dealing with emerging asset classes. A long-term perspective on this market is one we with you all to take, If price action is what gives you comfort, then consider that even at these levels, cryptocurrencies are still the best performing asset class of the past five years. A rush of institutional products are slated to be released in the early part of 2019 by financial industry leaders. Mass media won’t stop discussing this industry because millions are now invested and looking for guidance. Our long term outlook hasn’t changed despite the harsh climate of 2018. We are aligning ourselves with this industry for years to come as blockchain and cryptocurrency continue to reshape the world economy.

Mathew11:45:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

It would have been ok if it came with a MSSR adjustment in my view

I say would have been ok. Truth is I don't like it and voted against it - I think the feed price should be a true reflection of the market and we need to properly vet / manage the feeds we use to keep it as accurate as poss

Kathy Jameson11:45:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

JonnyB11:45:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

MSSR explained simply is a punishment of 10% for those who do not maintain their collateral. It's also a 10% bonus for those willing to buy margin calls.

JonnyB11:46:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I think it should be increased to 20%

JonnyB11:47:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Within the system 10% is written as 1.1

JonnyB11:47:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

20% would be written as 1.2

Alex M - clockwork11:48:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

Make the MSSR 1.2 as a minimum because feed price was ending up always 10% above the Dex price

this will furtehr drop the dex price

Alex M - clockwork11:48:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

not saying we shouldnt increase mssr

Mathew11:48:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

this will furtehr drop the dex price

Agree but the Dex price isn't what causes global settlement

R11:49:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

BSIP tried to protect margin holders and the peg at the expense of the system functioning as its meant to

No new usd can be created, if bts drops further in price then it'll be worth less than $1, that's all. Use Hz if you want to borrow 👌

Alex M - clockwork11:49:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

just saying it needs a balance and adjustments

JonnyB11:49:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

this will furtehr drop the dex price

Only temporarily until margin calls are all bought up

fractalnode11:49:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

Mssr at 20% is fine in an illiquid market

10% would be enough if the price feed was fair probably even 5% would be enough the problem is different and no one is discussing it here bots on CEX when they see the price lower by 10% on DEX. they will sell automatically on CEX and lower the price then the feed price will decrease even more then the price on DEX will drop again bots on CEX will start selling because last price on DEX is cheaper by 10% in this way, we fall into price drop loop to stop it, it must exist good arbitration system that will buy cheap (-10%) BTS from DEX

Mathew11:50:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

10% has been proven not to work by this GS

Mathew11:50:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So how do we get agreement to try 20%?

fractalnode11:50:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

10% has been proven not to work by this GS

not true

Alex M - clockwork11:50:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

10% has been proven not to work by this GS

not quite

Alex M - clockwork11:50:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

see fractal node's post

fractalnode11:50:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

it was not 10% it was -16% by bsip42

Alex M - clockwork11:51:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

combination fo what fractal node says and not enough conviction in applying bsip42 properly

Mathew11:52:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Sorry I'm dipping in and out as monster week at work so missing some posts. To confirm - I agree it is the combination of those two things that caused it

JonnyB11:52:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Bsip42 destroys the truth and this has huge unintended consequences throughout the very complex market mechanics of bitassets

Mathew11:53:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I agree 10% is probably fine a BSIP42 market. What I'm saying is bitUSD just GS'd. Why not try increasing MSSR to 1.2 for bitCNY

JonnyB11:53:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Return feeds to the true price

JonnyB11:53:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Tweak other stuff

Mathew11:53:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

Return feeds to the true price

Definitely agree with this

Mathew11:53:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

What about bitCNY right now?

Alex M - clockwork11:53:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

Tweak other stuff

thats the plan...only it couldn't/can't be done until now

Mathew11:53:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I see posts on the forum saying about fixing a 'protection price'

Alex M - clockwork11:53:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

hopefully will be sorted soon

Mathew11:53:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

This isn't right

Mathew11:53:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Margins should be sold

Mathew11:54:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Otherwise the system is just abandoning what is meant to make it work

Alex M - clockwork11:54:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

see a non pricefeed bsip42 suggestion here : https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27360.msg324958#msg324958

Mathew11:55:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

see a non pricefeed bsip42 suggestion here : https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27360.msg324958#msg324958

Agree, I didn't realise we could do dynamic MSSR now

JonnyB11:55:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

hopefully will be sorted soon

So bsip42 will be cancelled soon by bitcrab?

Mathew11:55:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Which is why I was saying just make it 20%

Mathew11:56:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

So bsip42 will be cancelled soon by bitcrab?

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27470.0

Alex M - clockwork11:56:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

So bsip42 will be cancelled soon by bitcrab?

dont think so....i mean that we won't have to implement it using a manipulated pricefeed

Mathew11:56:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

He wants to keep the feed and protect margin holders at the minute

JonnyB11:57:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Bsip42 is manipulated feeds

Alex M - clockwork11:57:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

He wants to keep bsip42 and protect margin holders at the minute

aint gonna happen...thats what fucked up bsip42 in the first place

Mathew11:57:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

aint gonna happen...thats what fucked up bsip42 in the first place

Mathew11:57:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

All the replies are yes definitely

Georgy11:57:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

not really...

my man, I feel lonely without you in that group you've just left lol

Alex M - clockwork11:57:39 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

Bsip42 is manipulated feeds

no...bsip 42 is tightening peg

Alex M - clockwork11:58:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

manipulating feeds was the suggested implementation because we couldnt have dynamic mcr/mssr due to a -core bug

Alex M - clockwork11:58:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ironandcopper

my man, I feel lonely without you in that group you've just left lol

enjoy the conspiracy theorists :)

JonnyB11:58:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

That's it's intended outcome not what it is. Again bsip42 is manipulated feeds

fractalnode11:58:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

manipulating feeds was the suggested implementation because we couldnt have dynamic mcr/mssr due to a -core bug

when this bug will be fixed?

Alex M - clockwork11:58:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

All the replies are yes definitely

i mean he cant have both.... he can protect shorters but peg will break

Mathew11:59:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

i mean he cant have both.... he can protect shorters but peg will break

It just says to me the main focus is protecting margin holders

Mathew11:59:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Which raises massive conflict of interest issues

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)11:59:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

MSSR to 20% at least! PLEASE! It's the absolute minimum. I am in favor to increase even 20%-50% ... It should be a very easy decision to make before another bitASSET get's GS...

JonnyB11:59:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I don't like the idea of dynamic paremeters. When you buy an option the parameters don't change.

Mathew12:00:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

I don't like the idea of dynamic paremeters. When you buy an option the parameters don't change.

I like the idea of dynamic but only at clear milestones. I.e. 30% when your collateral is down at 1.3 or less

JonnyB12:00:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

MSSR to 20% at least! PLEASE! It's the absolute minimum. I am in favor to increase even 20%-50% ... It should be a very easy decision to make before another bitASSET get's GS...

Bitcrab will not allow.

Mathew12:00:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

BitCNY is going to GS or abandon the basic premise of what it is

Mathew12:00:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Because we won't take any action on actually getting margins sold at the minute

Alex M - clockwork12:00:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

I don't like the idea of dynamic paremeters. When you buy an option the parameters don't change.

options don't need to be pegged though

Mathew12:01:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

At the risk of sounding a bit Thulish

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)12:01:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if we change to 20% practically we allready are dynamic... @Mylimbsarelong

Mathew12:01:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

BitUSD GS was gutting but if bitCNY does as well...

Alex M - clockwork12:01:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

It just says to me the main focus is protecting margin holders

true

Mathew12:01:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Basically it's only happening because too much of the power is centralised with margin holders

Mathew12:01:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Who will maintain their hold and BTS

Mathew12:01:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

With this BS

fractalnode12:02:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

10% worked well for the last three major drops let's not forget about it

Mathew12:02:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So...yeah, really knocking my confidence in it at the minute

Alex M - clockwork12:02:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

fractalnode

10% worked well for the last three major drops since 2015 let's not forget about it

admittedly this was the largest one

JonnyB12:02:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

if we change to 20% practically we allready are dynamic... @Mylimbsarelong

Yes I know what you mean. but one day all parameters should be fixed.or tweaked very rarely.

Alex M - clockwork12:02:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

Yes I know what you mean. but one day all parameters should be fixed.or tweaked very rarely.

impossible to keep a peg then

Alex M - clockwork12:02:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

or at least keep it tight enough

Mathew12:03:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We can say we are decentralised and vote etc but in reality of massive margin holders can change the rule to protect themselves and keep their holdings then really it's all a bit 'too big to fail' banks style

JonnyB12:03:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

impossible to keep a peg then

Keeping the peg is not the most important thing

JonnyB12:03:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Yup

Alex M - clockwork12:03:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

Keeping the peg is not the most important thing

theyre supposed to be pegged stabelcoins

Alex M - clockwork12:03:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

otehrwise lets just call them bitSpeculation1, bitSpeculation2 etc.

JonnyB12:04:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

They're pegged by forced settlement to the downside. They're allowed above

fractalnode12:04:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

admittedly this was the largest one

I still claim that it would work if it was not for manipulation

Alex M - clockwork12:04:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

They're pegged by forced settlement to the downside. They're allowed above

force settlement is severely limited....

Alex M - clockwork12:04:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

which is why they occasionally go into discount (pre bsip42 as well)

JonnyB12:05:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Force settlement allows you to take the face value of bitassets in BTS in 24hrs. It works

Alex M - clockwork12:05:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

a) 24 hrs is too long b) there is a limit to the amount that can be settled

JonnyB12:06:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

The best bit about it is no humans involved. Until bsip42 fucked it all up

JonnyB12:06:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So change it to 12 or 6 hours

fractalnode12:06:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

24 hrs protects shorters

Alex M - clockwork12:07:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

it can be greatly abused...remember...force settlement does NOT use the market

Alex M - clockwork12:07:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

force settlemet shrinks the least collateralised position

spirit absolute12:07:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

crypto community looks at us and how dpos work!

JonnyB12:07:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Increase the amount you can settle. After all it was bitcrab yet again who reduced the amount you can force settle.

Alex M - clockwork12:08:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if it worked we wouldnt have bitassets fluctuating between = and - 15%

Alex M - clockwork12:08:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

- and +

fractalnode12:09:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we do not have to mess with proven parameters bsip42 broke everything everything will be back to normal soon we do not have to change anything

Alex M - clockwork12:09:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

let's imagien for a moment

Alex M - clockwork12:09:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you have a bitUSD position

JonnyB12:10:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

- can and is arbitraged

Alex M - clockwork12:10:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

at 2 CR

Alex M - clockwork12:10:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

for a 100USD

Alex M - clockwork12:10:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

let's also assume that teh amrket is healthy

Alex M - clockwork12:10:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

an even at 2

Alex M - clockwork12:10:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

your position is the least collateralised

Alex M - clockwork12:10:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if I settle 100USD

Alex M - clockwork12:10:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

youre liquidated

Alex M - clockwork12:11:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

how long do you think it will take before youre all back here screamign if we remove force settlement limitations

Alex M - clockwork12:11:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mathew12:11:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27470.0

@Kimchiking @Cryptokong123 guys can some other people read and comment on this - i don't want it getting done on the basis 'it had good reception on the forum'

Mathew12:12:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

how long do you think it will take before youre all back here screamign if we remove force settlement limitations

Personally I think that would just push the margins up

Mathew12:12:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Not many people force settle anyway

Alex M - clockwork12:12:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

Personally I think that would just push the margins up

and completely break the peg

Mathew12:14:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ok I'm back at work, will read that back through later and try to get my head properly around why that breaks the peg. In my view for force settle MSSR should be 1.0 and for margin calls it should be: 1.1 for CR 1.75 - 1.30 1.2 for CR 1.29 - 1.1 1.4 for CR 1.09 - 1.000001

Mathew12:15:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I'm not sure what MSSR is for force settlements now, I'm assuming you're saying they would lose out 10% and the peg / promise would be broken for them

Cryptick Cryptick12:15:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Taking 24 hours to force settle stops bots from force settleing with small amounts of money. There is a good component to having time limitations on these things. A person should be able to go to get, or take a day off with out having too much happen to crypto positions.

Alex M - clockwork12:15:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nah...point is it would increase teh risk premium

Alex M - clockwork12:16:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and would send bitUSD skyrocketing

Alex M - clockwork12:16:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if you have to keep adding collateral to be "safe" from force settlement

Rma12:16:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

how long do you think it will take before youre all back here screamign if we remove force settlement limitations

isn't there a 24 hour delay, so you have the opportunity to increase your CR if you are the least collateralised

Rma12:16:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and not be the one who is settled

Alex M - clockwork12:16:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

youll be fucked if youre gonna sell bitUSD for 1USD

Alex M - clockwork12:17:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Rma

isn't there a 24 hour delay, so you have the opportunity to increase your CR if you are the least collateralised

yes...but its that delay (and other limitations) that mean the downwards peg is not upheld either

Alex M - clockwork12:17:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i liek the DAI mechanics ...but not sure how they could be applied to us

Alex M - clockwork12:18:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

they move the risk premium to a so-called variable stability fee which is paid by those settling the asset

Alex M - clockwork12:18:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

thus keepign a tighter peg with the rest of the mechanics similar to ours

Alex M - clockwork12:19:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

they essentially shift the premium from the asset itself to that fee

Alex M - clockwork12:19:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and although the users still pay it....its not part of teh value of teh asset

Alex M - clockwork12:19:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

keeping the asset itself better pegged

JonnyB12:21:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Rma

isn't there a 24 hour delay, so you have the opportunity to increase your CR if you are the least collateralised

Your confusing forced settlement for margin calls I think

Alex M - clockwork12:21:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

Your confusing forced settlement for margin calls I think

nope..forced settlements affect least collateralised position as well

Alex M - clockwork12:21:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

so the time limit does allow you to get out of the way

JonnyB12:23:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Oh yeah I see what meant now

JonnyB12:25:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

If we had mssr 30%or more I don't think we would have seen bitUSD Global settlement. Although it is hard to understand when bsip42 scews all incentives and meaning.

Dima BLCKCHND12:26:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Plan economic already fucked soviet union

JonnyB12:28:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I really feel alot of bsip42 supporters do not fully understand how bias bitcrab is with regards to market mechanics work. He has so much money on the line he will convince you any way he can that his proposals are a good idea. He's just protecting his wealth. Bsip42 supporters are blind to it.

JonnyB12:34:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Things bitcrab has got changed to protect his wealth. 1.) reduce force settlement % per 24hrs 2.) Increase force settlement offset to 5% from 1% 3.) Convinced Xeroc to let him run an open market operations fund WTF! 4.) Introduced Bsip42 to manipulate price feeds. 5.) Wants to (not yet) lower maintenance collateral ratio 6.) Wants to (not yet) decrease mssr when the sensible thing is to increase it.

JonnyB12:37:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

The conflict of interests when it comes to bitcrabs opinion are huge.

Mathew12:44:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

(3) was really nuts. Seeing that fund at the top of the list getting called is a serious low moment for the committee.

Mathew12:45:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Every step taken to 'protect the peg' has protected margin holders, every single one of them.

Mathew12:46:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

That's an issue

R12:47:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

fractalnode

we do not have to mess with proven parameters bsip42 broke everything everything will be back to normal soon we do not have to change anything

Yeah to be fair all these experiments should probably be proven on test bitassets first, not on live smartcoins

R12:48:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

Reasons to use alternative bitassets 👍 don't limit yourself on the dex

JonnyB12:52:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Reasons to use alternative bitassets 👍 don't limit yourself on the dex

alternative bitassets have their own set of problems . We need to nail BitUSD first.

George (Bitspark)12:56:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

👍👍 agree

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:04:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Trying to protect someone has sometimes the opposite result... If the mechanics would work better, the shorters would be much more protected in the sense that we would have more people willing to use a fair system where the markets are as free as possible.... Too much rules make the system too complicated for the average Joe to start trading on our platform....

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:05:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

And without traders and mass adoption as aresult don't expect BTS to grow ...

Fabian Schuh13:06:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

**finally**, all the bitshares.eu nodes back online: https://bitshares.eu/haproxy

Valera Cogut13:10:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

👍

Ole13:25:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Is this the first time we’ve had a GS on bitUSD?

Alex M - clockwork13:26:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

2nd i think

Alex M - clockwork13:26:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

1st one was like within the first month...

Fabian Schuh13:26:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

First

Fabian Schuh13:26:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Nop

Alex M - clockwork13:27:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

prior to graphene

Alex M - clockwork13:27:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Alex M - clockwork13:27:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Fabian Schuh13:27:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We havent had a GS on usd back then ..

Fabian Schuh13:27:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

But on SEK and KRW and RUB

Alex M - clockwork13:27:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bad memory

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:27:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and bitGOLD

Alex M - clockwork13:27:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bitsilver

Alex M - clockwork13:27:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bitbtc

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:28:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yep

Ole13:28:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Interesting

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:29:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Knowing history is easy to predict what will come next :)

Ole13:30:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Whats your take on the future for bitUSD then?

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:30:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ask me about bitCNY

R13:31:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ole

Whats your take on the future for bitUSD then?

discounts 👍

Ole13:32:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

Ask me about bitCNY

Think ive figure that one out:)

Ole13:32:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

discounts 👍

You think bitUSD will weaken even more?

Mathew13:32:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mylimbsarelong

@xeroc what's your view on this? I haven't been keen on the various personal attacks and have been stepping in to highlight people need to do something proactive to contribute. Nobody has more 'skin in the game' than Bitcrab so he wants BTS to succeed. That said it does feel like every 'protect the peg' initiatives have been very heavily protecting margins. Whether that's intentional or not this latest proposal about a bitCNY floor price to protect it is pure margin protection. Isn't it time to try doing something to improve the thing that is meant to protect bitAssets from failing? I.e. increase MSSR?

R13:33:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ole

You think bitUSD will weaken even more?

If BTS drops in value then the settlement pool is worth less, so yeah. If BTS rises in value then it's worth more.

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:35:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

What ever happens we must revive all bitASSETS under new rules (like MSSR higher etc.) if we want to survive. Our strength is our stable coins, everything else is easy to find from competitors...

Fabian Schuh13:36:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

I dont like putting a floor on feeds. Also, in the current situation, there are not too many options. Certainly, bsip42 needs to stay active until we leave black swan area .. Say 150% of least collateralized position. Then i would still prefer go back to 'fair price' feeding and instead use other means dynamically to incentivize traders (e.g. mssr, mcr, settlement offsey). Maybe even implement alex's proposal or abit proposal.

Alex M - clockwork13:36:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

fwiw

Alex M - clockwork13:37:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

interesting discussion from way back in the day

Alex M - clockwork13:37:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=7843.0

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:37:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Markets as free as possibel, not too many rules guys

Mathew13:37:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

Isn't adjusting MSSR something we can do right now? If it was set to 20% / 1.2 then it would be 10% below the dex price (as per the original intention) and these margin walls might start to get eaten.

Alex M - clockwork13:37:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

BM strongly suggesting that feeds should be used and set in order to KEEP the peg

Fabian Schuh13:38:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

If you increase mssr to 20% on bitcny, we have a GS

Mathew13:39:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

If you increase mssr to 20% on bitcny, we have a GS

Only if the feed price drops as well? Or have I misunderstood that?

Mathew13:39:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

The Dex price doesn't impact GS...

Mathew13:39:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

He said uncertainly...

Alex M - clockwork13:39:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

dex price is part of the feed price

Alex M - clockwork13:40:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

also , dex is one of the highest volume ones...so heavily weighted too

Alex M - clockwork13:43:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ofcourse we could drop all the margins to market price and manipulate feed to ensure it doesnt GS but thats cheating even more

Mathew13:43:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hmm what a mess

Fabian Schuh13:44:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

matle85

Only if the feed price drops as well? Or have I misunderstood that?

GS happens when least collateral position cannot buy from market .. It buys at market with 10% (mssr) premium. Hence, GS is at 110% In case of mssr 20%: 120%

Fabian Schuh13:44:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Least collateralized on bitcny was 112% last time i checked

Alex M - clockwork13:45:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

ah yes

Alex M - clockwork13:45:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

good point

Mathew13:45:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Lame times

Alex M - clockwork13:45:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i forgot mssr increases gs price

Alex M - clockwork13:45:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

shit

Alex M - clockwork13:45:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

totally forgot that one

Mathew13:45:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Yeah I didn't realise that

Crypto Kong13:45:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

What did i miss?

Crypto Kong13:46:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Has anyone considered a GS might be needed to reset this complete and utter shit show

Alex M - clockwork13:47:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

Has anyone considered a GS might be needed to reset this complete and utter shit show

your belief that after a reset we wont have a greater shitshow is shaky at best :D

Crypto Kong13:47:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Well there is that

Alex M - clockwork13:47:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

although it's crossed my mind as well

Crypto Kong13:48:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

At the moment too much time and energy is being wasted trying to patch up a complete fuck up

Crypto Kong13:48:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Let it blow and start from scratch

Crypto Kong13:48:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Sometimes you need to accept you fucked up

Alex M - clockwork13:48:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nah

Alex M - clockwork13:48:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

just buy a bigger bike :D

Crypto Kong13:49:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

All i see on that forum post is bitcrab gambling on price going up again, which is what got us here in the first place

Mathew13:50:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

All i see on that forum post is bitcrab gambling on price going up again, which is what got us here in the first place

I'd rather have GS than this option

R13:50:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

your belief that after a reset we wont have a greater shitshow is shaky at best :D

Might be what we need to kick voter apathy in the teeth? lol

Mathew13:50:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

It's just kicking the issue down the road

Crypto Kong13:51:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

The longer it goes on the lower the price will be that everyone gets called

Crypto Kong13:51:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

The more painful it will be

Alex M - clockwork13:52:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Might be what we need to kick voter apathy in the teeth? lol

see...this has always been my worry... beating voter apathy...without voter education...is much much worse

Alex M - clockwork13:52:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i'd rather have people not vote

Alex M - clockwork13:53:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

than vote based on what they understood some guy claimed another guy said on reddit

R13:54:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Everyone off the democracy train, y'all aint educated to ride! lol The same thing happens in normal democracy

Alex M - clockwork13:54:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Everyone off the democracy train, y'all aint educated to ride! lol The same thing happens in normal democracy

actually

Alex M - clockwork13:55:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i'm greek

Cryptick Cryptick13:55:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Voter education, apathy, and engagement are issues that may benefit from a change in tactics. Maybe there is a better way.

Alex M - clockwork13:55:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we invented the damn thing

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:55:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

i forgot mssr increases gs price

So if we increase enough we have 2 good things, margin walls will got eaten easier and GS increase...

Crypto Kong13:55:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

we invented the damn thing

Lol

Alex M - clockwork13:55:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you might wanna check on who was allowed to vote back then

Alex M - clockwork13:55:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Crypto Kong13:55:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

😁

Alex M - clockwork13:55:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

So if we increase enough we have 2 good things, margin walls will got eaten easier and GS increase...

no no ...INCREASE gs price... i.e it happens sooner

R13:55:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

i'm greek

Yeah I know, haha :D

Crypto Kong13:56:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

So if we increase enough we have 2 good things, margin walls will got eaten easier and GS increase...

Presuming there are enough buyers....

Crypto Kong13:56:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Presuming the market goes up....

Crypto Kong13:56:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

This is gambling not a solution

Crypto Kong13:57:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Its becoming less and less proffesional by the minute

Cryptick Cryptick13:57:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Understanding what is going on is complicated. This might be simplified via more education, official publications, cross platform publishing ect. making sure people thoughts are appreciated, considered and implemented are also important.

Cryptick Cryptick13:57:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

This is gambling not a solution

yeah it is.

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)13:57:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we can update to the previous bugy version if absolutely needed 😁

Cryptick Cryptick13:58:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

And with the entire crypto market in a downtrend betting on a turnaround now is wishful thinking.

Crypto Kong13:58:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Lol yeah just stop the chain for 6 months is a better idea 😂

Crypto Kong13:58:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Just stop providing feeds for cny lol

Crypto Kong13:59:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptick1

And with the entire crypto market in a downtrend betting on a turnaround now is wishful thinking.

Exactly

Alex M - clockwork13:59:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

Just stop providing feeds for cny lol

same result....no more borrowing allowed

Crypto Kong13:59:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

At best we go sideways for a few montgs

Cryptick Cryptick13:59:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

Just stop providing feeds for cny lol

How about we just change the feeds to whatever makes us feel warm on fuzzy inside...

Crypto Kong13:59:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Lol

R13:59:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

same result....no more borrowing allowed

Ah, but no settlement/margin-calls 200% IQ lol

Crypto Kong13:59:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptick1

How about we just change the feeds to whatever makes us feel warm on fuzzy inside...

I thought we already were 😂

Cryptick Cryptick14:00:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

I thought we already were 😂

BSIP Ostrich: We stick our head in the sand.

Crypto Kong14:00:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Lol

Cryptick Cryptick14:00:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

I thought we already were 😂

how is that working for us?

Crypto Kong14:00:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Fantastic! Lol

Cryptick Cryptick14:00:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Quick Someone else pull head out of sand and look up.... I don't want to.

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)14:02:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We could make a worker proposal to pay bytemaster for an advice for the specific situation... 😄

Crypto Kong14:02:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

If bitcrab is so sure price will rise and there are so many buyers ready to eat his great margin wall of China... then why does he have a prob with GS? There should be plenty of bidders, settlers and a price increase to revive.

Alex M - clockwork14:02:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

We could make a worker proposal to pay bytemaster for an advice for the specific situation... 😄

i posted his thread from abck in teh day

Alex M - clockwork14:02:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

but it goes against everyone saying the peg is not important

Alex M - clockwork14:02:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

so it was ignored :P

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)14:03:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Low volume back then

Cryptick Cryptick14:03:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

This is serious stuff. If BTS is going to survive long term, it needs to get it all figured out.

Alex M - clockwork14:03:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

also, BM is briliant...does not in any way mean he got everything right

Cryptick Cryptick14:03:39 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Ironically, it seems like we are all central bankers now. (The very thing crypto was intended to fix in the 2009 financial crisis...)

Mathew14:03:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Yep

Mathew14:03:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Too big to fail

Alex M - clockwork14:03:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

most of the stuff we're trying to figure out is because his initial decisions dont seem to be workign that well

Crypto Kong14:04:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Exactly. Let them fail

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)14:04:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

DAI copied 95% of BTS mechanics... Let's just copy from them the remaining 5% (+5)

Memet14:04:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

What Oldex error

Alex M - clockwork14:05:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

liondani

DAI copied 95% of BTS mechanics... Let's just copy from them the remaining 5% (+5)

been thinkign about that....not sure how we can implement it yet

Cryptick Cryptick14:08:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

One of the things I noticed and don't like is I see all the margin players taking 100% as much margin as they can. They issue bitUSD, turn around and buy BTS. (This in effect drives up the prices and BTS and allows them to issue more.) They take out way to much margin. If they didn't drive up the price so hard, it wouldn't come down so hard.

nutela14:10:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

not so much in a low vol one

So make it a function of the volume

Cryptick Cryptick14:10:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

And antoher things that rarely seems talked about is that it appears one wants to be the most margined, because on the way down, you can be the one that absorbs all the liquidity, -which is limited. By absorbing all the liquidity you are in a better position relative to other margin traders. However, this is sort of like standing up at a football game. (While you can see better, if everyone does it, no one sees better.)

Cryptick Cryptick14:11:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I know there are some games played, but we need to look at the real underlying problems. Too much debt, too many incentives and too many games.

Cryptick Cryptick14:11:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

In the long run we need to be building long term value, not trading against each other.

Cryptick Cryptick14:11:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

And right now, there are too few people in BTS and it is sort of hard to convince more people to invest at the moment

Cryptick Cryptick14:12:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We need to take teh time to plan real value and growth in the future.

R14:12:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptick1

And right now, there are too few people in BTS and it is sort of hard to convince more people to invest at the moment

There's a lot of bitshares users, 10k people in here too

Cryptick Cryptick14:12:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We need a more coordinated budget, more workers, more advertsing, more ways to get ordinary people invovled.

Cryptick Cryptick14:13:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

There's a lot of bitshares users, 10k people in here too

While there are 10K in here, there are 7 billion in the world, 330 million in USA....

Cryptick Cryptick14:14:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Everyone want to see this succeed big, but that takes real world solutions. Not somthing people are thinking about when GS is going on...

Playtronics One14:16:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

When I try to run the Bitshare wallet I keep getting this error message "BLOCKCHAIN IS OUT OF SYNC, PLEASE WAIT UNTIL IT'S SYNCHRONIZED.." I thought this had been resolved, and please the link to the BitShares-Core-2.0.181127-Windows-x64-cli-tools the installer does not work.

R14:16:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptick1

Everyone want to see this succeed big, but that takes real world solutions. Not somthing people are thinking about when GS is going on...

GS doesn't affect everyone nor does it stall developments, fair enough it might affect public perception but at least there's collateral behind the bitasset where as FIAT has zero backing collateral (same goes for tether)

R14:16:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Playtronics

connect to a different node?

Alex M - clockwork14:16:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yes...possible all nodes have not synced yet

Alex M - clockwork14:17:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

or upgraded

Alex M - clockwork14:17:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

windows core issue is known...hopefully fixed soon

Jam PR14:17:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Loknar

The only thing that can be effectively used is the MCR...Not only that 1.75 doesn't do the job at this circumstances, but it should also be dynamic, meaning it should change with market maturity / liquidity ..

agreed ... real world brokers will change collateral requirements based on market conditions ... when volatility goes up, the MCR goes up. It's better to trigger margin calls and settle them sooner than later ... its good for the margin holders as well since they will get some of their money back instead of none ... if its all done right

Alex M - clockwork14:18:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

jambitshares

see my suggestion here: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27360.msg324958#msg324958

Jam PR14:23:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

see my suggestion here: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27360.msg324958#msg324958

I see the concern for fighting premiums so the peg holds tighter ... would it be possible to set up an open source arbitrage bot and let real users (who also have CEX accounts) run the arb bot to minimize the premiums. Then could we be more conservative with the MCR?

Alex M - clockwork14:24:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

jambitshares

possibly..not sure about the voluem and fundign required though

Jam PR14:26:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

that would kind of backandedly give the system access to real fiat and offload some of the risk (and potential profit) to the arb traders

Paxful14:36:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

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R15:15:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

can you guys actually access the exchange?

Alex M - clockwork15:16:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yep

One Geneko15:16:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I can't

Alex M - clockwork15:17:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

half the nodes are apasia's

Alex M - clockwork15:17:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

not sure if theyre finished upgrading/syncing yet

funkit15:17:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I had problems with Open Ledger earlier today. the reference works smooth.

Alex M - clockwork15:18:09 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

also...if any of you are using desktop light clients from before April release

R15:18:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

has the GS price magically decreased?

Alex M - clockwork15:18:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

wont work with updated nodes

R15:19:39 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

has the GS price magically decreased?

Alex M - clockwork15:20:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

talking to yourself?

Alex M - clockwork15:20:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

let me guess

R15:20:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

funny

Alex M - clockwork15:21:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

misread 1.12 as 1.2

R15:25:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

they have decreased a little from 70 million BTS

R15:25:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

to 68.2

R15:27:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

talking to yourself?

People copying my nick 🙄 lol

Alex M - clockwork15:29:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i honestly didnt norice

Alex M - clockwork15:29:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

notice

Jake Collins15:40:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Anyone know a good crypto card? MasterCard or Visa?

One Geneko15:40:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

also...if any of you are using desktop light clients from before April release

Thanks. I have instaled newer version of client and now it works fine

Alex M - clockwork15:45:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

C🇧

C.P. Bentley Pixel 🇧🇪15:46:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptick1

We need to take teh time to plan real value and growth in the future.

i cannot donate bitusd to random people

C🇧

C.P. Bentley Pixel 🇧🇪15:47:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

they would need an account

C🇧

C.P. Bentley Pixel 🇧🇪15:48:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

somehow we need a universal wallet

C🇧

C.P. Bentley Pixel 🇧🇪15:49:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

and this is far in the future

Channel_Bot16:07:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

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Mick [BTS][eostalk.io]16:53:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

you might wanna check on who was allowed to vote back then

👆

Crypto Guy17:10:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

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Cryptick Cryptick17:27:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

So is there an official report on the bug yesterday that shut down the blockchain? Anyone know where it would be?

Ross Walker17:31:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

https://github.com/bitshares/bitshares-core/issues

Ross Walker17:32:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

or bitsharestalk.org

Crypto Kong17:32:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Would it be possible to create an automatic credit refference score for bitshares accounts? So if an account gets margin called, everyday they are under 1.75 it adds a score to the account, the higher the score the higher the minimum ratio they can borrow at in future. This would also affect target ratios automatically added to underwater positions, so rather than an account setting a target of 1.75 and constantly being called, it would auto set to 2 and if called again, would go to 2.1 etc. Thoughts?

Slavi La Libertad17:33:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Change account and get a normal score. :)

R17:33:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

Not all bitassets are equal though

Crypto Kong17:33:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Not all bitassets are equal though

not all credit scoring has to be the same

Crypto Kong17:34:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

memset

Change account and get a normal score. :)

yes there is that but you cant whilst underwater

Crypto Kong17:34:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you would have to clear the debt first

nutela17:36:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

that can also cause the peg to get lost though

Can you elaborate how Alex or point in a direction?

nutela17:36:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

see my suggestion here: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=27360.msg324958#msg324958

Sounds good on a first read

Cryptick Cryptick17:37:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

Yes. This would be fairly easy to do. I know how it could be done in Google Spreadsheets.

nutela17:38:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

Ah a social credit score ;))

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:38:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

hi there

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:38:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

is there password recovery on bitshares

Cryptick Cryptick17:39:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Wole_Babayeju

is there password recovery on bitshares

Generally No.

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:39:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

@admin

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:39:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

do u know that for a fact? are u admin and what does generally no mean

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:39:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

its either there is or there isnt

Cryptick Cryptick17:39:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Wole_Babayeju

is there password recovery on bitshares

Tell us more though, what is going on? One portal does have that option... easydex, but they are fairly new.

R17:39:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Wole_Babayeju

do u know that for a fact? are u admin and what does generally no mean

Nobody other than you has the password

は

はるか17:40:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

easydex has some mechanisms for that?

R17:40:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

easydex has some mechanisms for that?

Email stored password recovery? Maybe

は

はるか17:40:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

that's... not how that should be

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:40:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

guy, im not saying anybody else should have my password, im saying if the system has password recovery

Cryptick Cryptick17:40:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

easydex has some mechanisms for that?

I believe so, (haven't used it) but there was some way if you regestered there they did...

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:41:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

R17:41:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

that's... not how that should be

Yeah just joking lol

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:41:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

its cool

は

はるか17:41:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

no recovery mechanisms on blockchain

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:41:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i guess i got my answer

は

はるか17:41:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

that said, one could invent some using the permission system

Cryptick Cryptick17:43:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Wole_Babayeju

i guess i got my answer

What type of wallet, because you may have saved a bin file on your machine or saved the password in a browser...

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:44:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptick1

What type of wallet, because you may have saved a bin file on your machine or saved the password in a browser...

bitshares

Cryptick Cryptick17:44:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Wole_Babayeju

bitshares

there are cloud wallets and local wallets.

は

はるか17:44:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

there are brain key (mnemonics) if you go local wallet

Crypto Kong17:45:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

that said, one could invent some using the permission system

easydex has a password recovery system but you have to create an account through them and enable it i think

は

はるか17:45:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

but that doesn't qualify as password recovery I think

は

はるか17:45:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

easydex has a password recovery system but you have to create an account through them and enable it i think

checking

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:45:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

https://wallet.bitshares.org/#/account/body-beauty

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:46:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

it is not easydex

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:46:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

easydex is a completely different platform

Crypto Kong17:47:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

New web wallet accounts created through the EasyDex UI have the option of storing an encrypted version of their password in our databases. Through our 2 step process, the user (and only the user) can recover their password.

Crypto Kong17:47:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

https://steemit.com/easydex/@easydex/announcing-easydex-open-beta-launch-fiat-deposit-withdrawals-and-trustless-account-recovery-on-bitshares

Mr. Shobi17:47:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Summary pls. Why have we crashed so hard (dont say only bitcoin pls)?

は

はるか17:48:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Wole_Babayeju

easydex is a completely different platform

it IS running on bitshares

Crypto Kong17:48:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mr. Shobi

Summary pls. Why have we crashed so hard (dont say only bitcoin pls)?

bitcoin

Cryptick Cryptick17:48:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mr. Shobi

Summary pls. Why have we crashed so hard (dont say only bitcoin pls)?

Crypto makret down, Global settlement on bit USD.

Wole Babayeju - EOS Go17:49:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

but guy my question wasnt about easydex is it or maybe im missing the point

Crypto Kong17:49:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptick1

Crypto makret down, Global settlement on bit USD.

price hasnt dropped an inch since GS

は

はるか17:49:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

the blockchain itself doesn't provide such mechanisms

は

はるか17:49:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if that's what you want to know

Crypto Kong17:49:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

the blockchain itself doesn't provide such mechanisms

correct

Mr. Shobi17:50:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

What does that mean (global settlement and its effect) i dont understand. I did read above but dont get it

Crypto Kong17:50:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Wole_Babayeju

but guy my question wasnt about easydex is it or maybe im missing the point

you were asking about password recovery, there is an option for it but not by the blockchain by easydex

Cryptick Cryptick17:50:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Just create a new account. I thought you might have had some real money in the account...

Crypto Kong17:50:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Mr. Shobi

What does that mean (global settlement and its effect) i dont understand. I did read above but dont get it

https://steemit.com/bitshares/@bitshares.fdn/how-global-settlements-work

Mr. Shobi17:51:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

K thx

は

はるか17:54:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

err

Mr. Shobi17:54:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Yup still dont get it. But from what i get is iys all abt protecting the loan and not enough buyers to buy the liquidated/secured bts per bitusd

は

はるか17:55:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

seems this is preventing me from registering on easydex

Mr. Shobi17:55:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Its a good coin. We/I will be back in 8 mo. Tc all

Crypto Kong17:55:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

seems this is preventing me from registering on easydex

https://t.me/easydex

は

はるか17:56:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

what's the correct faucet address for onboarding btw?

Stefan17:56:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

That would be a ES query that can give you the count, nothing needed to store in chain

Crypto Kong17:56:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

they were having problems with their node... not sure if that would affect it

Crypto Kong17:57:03 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

sschiessl

That would be a ES query that can give you the count, nothing needed to store on chain

whats your opinion on the idea?

Stefan18:00:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

whats your opinion on the idea?

The data is already there. What would you do with such a number?

Crypto Kong18:01:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

The idea is to create a better system for responsible use of margin. Automatically setting target ratios and minimum allowed ratios etc

Crypto Kong18:02:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

so the more a person is called... the higher their target ratio will be automatically set

Crypto Kong18:03:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

people tend to set there ratios to 1.75. They set targets of 1.75, get called, return to 1.75, get called repeat

Crypto Kong18:03:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

My idea is to have the blockchain or the system or whatever count the number of times they are called and adjust their minimum target ratio

Mathew18:04:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

My idea is to have the blockchain or the system or whatever count the number of times they are called and adjust their minimum target ratio

This is actually a smart idea

Crypto Kong18:04:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

so a user might get called, bitshares see this is the third time and instead of allowing target ratio of 1.75 set a ratio of 2.5

Mathew18:05:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

They can work around it with new accounts of course

Crypto Kong18:05:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yes but they would have to clear their debt first

Mathew18:05:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Yes of course

Crypto Kong18:05:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you cant transfer debt from one account to another without paying it off

Mathew18:05:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I like it

Mathew18:05:46 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Sign me up

Crypto Kong18:06:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I think it could really help (if its buildable)

Mathew18:06:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I've been margin called 0 times, globally settled once

は

はるか18:06:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

yes but they would have to clear their debt first

what does "clear up debt" exactly mean here?

Mathew18:06:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Yeah because it's the same people margining themselves to the balls everytime to try and make their money back

Mathew18:06:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

what does "clear up debt" exactly mean here?

Close their margin

Crypto Kong18:06:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

what does "clear up debt" exactly mean here?

pay it off

Crypto Kong18:06:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

close position

Crypto Kong18:07:10 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you cant move an open position to another account

は

はるか18:07:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

so unless it's above the CR limit you won't be able to move smartcoins?

Crypto Kong18:08:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i think your missing the point...

は

はるか18:08:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I think I could understand until this part...

Clement18:08:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

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Clement18:08:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Crypto Kong18:08:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

someone said you could just change account after you received a bad credit rating, I said yes they could but they would have to close their position first, which is good.

Crypto Kong18:09:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Even if we ignore the whole credit rating idea... Just not allowing a minimum target ratio lower than 2 would help

Stefan18:09:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We have a liquidy problem as is. BitAsset creation must be easy, but punishment swift if not maintained. I like the idea in the forum that you can force against open margin calls, or directly bid on them if ratio smaller than X

は

はるか18:09:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

seems difficult to prevent all transfer because of the debt...

Crypto Kong18:10:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yes i like that idea too... but we need more ideas, that alone will not solve the problem

Crypto Kong18:10:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

it will most certainly help

Stefan18:11:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

In a bear market like it is a fully collaterized stable coin is simply hard to maintain without a centralized debtor. Simple as that

Crypto Kong18:12:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

when people get called and only sell off enough to bring them back to 1.75... that does not help things. If you are called target ratio should be higher

Crypto Kong18:12:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we should not allow 1.75 as a target ratio

Crypto Kong18:12:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

everyone with 1.75 is pretty much instantly called again

は

はるか18:13:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I remember I was reading everywhere that smartcoins on bitshares work by putting up 2x collateral ratio

Daniel18:13:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Do you think BTS will survive?

fractalnode18:13:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

everyone with 1.75 is pretty much instantly called again

everyone has the right to make the choice they want

Crypto Kong18:13:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

I remember I was reading everywhere that smartcoins on bitshares work by putting up 2x collateral ratio

yeah we should actually make it that

Crypto Kong18:13:37 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

fractalnode

everyone has the right to make the choice they want

not if we change it

Crypto Kong18:13:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

thats the point

Crypto Kong18:13:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

not giving people the option to make decisions that bring the whole system down

fractalnode18:14:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

not if we change it

why do you want to decide for someone

Crypto Kong18:14:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

well lets just allow 1.01 then eh?

Crypto Kong18:14:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

let them decide

Crypto Kong18:14:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

then we will be in permenant GS forevery

fractalnode18:15:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

not giving people the option to make decisions that bring the whole system down

the system is all right the problem was bsip42

Crypto Kong18:15:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

fractalnode

the system is all right the problem was bsip42

no its not

Crypto Kong18:15:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

bsip42 was shit

Crypto Kong18:15:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

so are the GS mechanism

Crypto Kong18:15:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

how can you expect people to trust a system where they can manage their position well and have it closed by some stranger on the other side of the globes bad managemnt

Stefan18:16:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

when people get called and only sell off enough to bring them back to 1.75... that does not help things. If you are called target ratio should be higher

It wasn't too much different before. You still needed a buyer that takes the whole margin.

Mick [BTS][eostalk.io]18:16:11 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

My idea is to have the blockchain or the system or whatever count the number of times they are called and adjust their minimum target ratio

🤘

Stefan18:16:57 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

so are the GS mechanism

Yea, it.should punish the low collateral positions and not the maintained ones

Crypto Kong18:17:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

yup

Crypto Kong18:17:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

another thought i had....

Crypto Kong18:17:49 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

when price goes up, is there a way that the call price could be delayed so called postitions dont recover as quick?

fractalnode18:18:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

there would be no discussion about the system if the feed price would match the market

R18:18:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Daniel

Do you think BTS will survive?

Yes, ultimately bts is unaffected internally by bitasset operations

Jonathan Bahai18:19:12 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

anyone else having issues with the Voting in the wallet.bitshares.org GUI? I am getting nothing but a blank grey screen with menu items.. blocks still counting

Crypto Kong18:19:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

fractalnode

there would be no discussion about the system if the feed price would match the market

global settlement would have happened earlier so yes there would

fractalnode18:20:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you don't know that

Crypto Kong18:20:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

lol ok

Stefan18:20:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

JBahai

anyone else having issues with the Voting in the wallet.bitshares.org GUI? I am getting nothing but a blank grey screen with menu items.. blocks still counting

Try a different node please

fractalnode18:24:00 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

besides, witnesses should use their powers and propose different sets of MSSR

Alfredo Garcia18:24:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

JBahai

anyone else having issues with the Voting in the wallet.bitshares.org GUI? I am getting nothing but a blank grey screen with menu items.. blocks still counting

this is probably a node in the previous release, before this incident of chain halt we had another issue with the voting page

Alfredo Garcia18:24:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we released a patch for that but probably the node you are connecting to dont have it

Jonathan Bahai18:34:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

oxarbitrage

this is probably a node in the previous release, before this incident of chain halt we had another issue with the voting page

Got it.. will try later.. gotta get back to conference now :)

Jonathan Bahai18:34:48 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

At ICE sports betting in NYC for @peerplays

Alfredo Garcia18:35:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

👍

Alfredo Garcia18:35:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

that looks good :)

Abit More18:42:04 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

harukaff_bot

I remember I was reading everywhere that smartcoins on bitshares work by putting up 2x collateral ratio

I remember it's said 3x

Jordan Right18:53:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

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Jon Stamos19:03:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

Exactly. This is the point most miss. Regardless of wether they end up proving something is a security or not. They can still seize all your assets and basically ruin peoples lives until a decision is made. Jared rice is a perfect example of this, they made all these accusations, seized EVERYTHING, ruined his life and a year later they still havent actually come up with a result either way.

I don’t know man. He’s been involved in some fishy business for a while. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/BitShares/comments/7r69lv/due_diligence_a_primer_by_example/

Stevie Nicks19:09:30 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Is BitCNY the only smart asset that hasn't GS'd yet? Trying to figure out what assets are currently shortable

nutela19:09:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

sschiessl

In a bear market like it is currently a fully collaterized stable coin is simply hard to maintain without a centralized debtor. Simple as that

Sounds like we are talking about governance. Where have I heard that before? 🤔

Stefan19:10:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Stevie Nicks

Is BitCNY the only smart asset that hasn't GS'd yet? Trying to figure out what assets are currently shortable

EUR and CNY, and Ruble iirc

nutela19:10:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Cryptokong123

bsip42 was shit

According to a few Chinese guys on bitsharestalk bsip42 was good

Once Uponatime19:17:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Fawkess

I don’t know man. He’s been involved in some fishy business for a while. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/BitShares/comments/7r69lv/due_diligence_a_primer_by_example/

You fell for a hit piece from someone who just joined Redditt for that one post, has never posted since, and has no comments?

Jordan Right19:18:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Jordan Right19:18:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Let's do this

Mick [BTS][eostalk.io]19:32:08 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Would be nice if all started using bitsharestalk.io considering it’s on chain

Mick [BTS][eostalk.io]19:32:20 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Thx @SirFuzzalot

R19:40:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Stevie Nicks

Is BitCNY the only smart asset that hasn't GS'd yet? Trying to figure out what assets are currently shortable

Hertz too 👍

Stevie Nicks19:41:02 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

👍 thanks guys

fractalnode19:44:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

is there any way to combine all the EBA.BTC tokens in one market ?

nutela19:46:06 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cmmob

Hertz too 👍

Haha keep preachiiing 😂

nutela19:46:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

One day I will see the light and we’ll go like, Uh why didn’t we see that before? We can bet on algo’s! Fight AI…

nutela19:47:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Much cooler than fighting people, SkyNet!

Jordan Right19:55:17 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

R19:55:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

fractalnode

is there any way to combine all the EBA.BTC tokens in one market ?

Potentially: https://github.com/bitshares/bsips/issues/100

R19:55:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Haha keep preachiiing 😂

Gotta market it somehow, isn't going to bootstrap itself lol

Dominic19:56:18 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Kristin Low19:56:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

nut3l4

Haha keep preachiiing 😂

Love Hertz, fascinating concept!

Maria Kareen Hartford20:17:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hi there Make $700 every 65 minutes comment your Country name I will send you a link to start earning dm @ig kareenHartford btc investor. Bitcoin is low now so I guess now is best to invest.

Jon Stamos20:17:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

onceponatime

You fell for a hit piece from someone who just joined Redditt for that one post, has never posted since, and has made no comments?

Oh really? So his previous scams are fake too I’m assuming: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=466133.0 I’m giving you evidence. You’re giving me nothing. I’ll end it here.

Alex M - clockwork20:25:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Oh god not again

Once Uponatime20:32:55 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

Oh god not again

Yeah, who is this Jon Stamos guy and why do you think he is bringing it up again? (And just as Jared is releasing as a gift to the community all his work of the last 11 months). What the fuck?

evolution20:38:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

New Bitshares design is not good. Blocks without borders are confusing…

Kristin Low20:50:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Where did you see that?

nutela21:00:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

BTS price needs to be > $0.08 to revive BitUSD barrowing?

Fabian Schuh21:02:41 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

automatic revival, yes ..

Fabian Schuh21:02:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

that's when the settlement pool is 1.75x valuation of debt

Alex M - clockwork21:03:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

~ 8.9

Alex M - clockwork21:03:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

need to remember to place a bid at 8.899999999999999999999999999

CZ Binance21:03:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Hello guys

CZ Binance21:03:26 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

How are you?

CZ Binance21:03:43 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

market is bad now

CZ Binance21:03:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

but i still holding iota

CZ Binance21:03:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

lol

Fabian Schuh21:03:58 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

need to remember to place a bid at 8.899999999999999999999999999

Need to reread BSIP18 .. i believe that you need to provide the amount of debt you want to obtain when playing a bid ..

CZ Binance21:04:05 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i belive in ADA

CZ Binance21:04:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I am from Canada

CZ Binance21:04:36 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Just inerested in Telegram

CZ Binance21:04:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

join only few minutes ago

Fabian Schuh21:04:54 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Viva_Bubazik

i belive in ADA

This is a bitshares channel, please stick to the topic or join some general crypto currency channel ...

Alex M - clockwork21:05:07 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

xeroc

Need to reread BSIP18 .. i believe that you need to provide the amount of debt you want to obtain when playing a bid ..

7.5m USD :D

CZ Binance21:05:15 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Okay. thank you

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)21:36:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I just had a crazy idea... We could have dynamic MSSR that gets calculated from the blockchain and is depended on price fluctuation and behavior of the bitasset and responds like Bollinger bands...

Alex M - clockwork21:37:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

could work IF vast majority of volume was on the dex

Alex M - clockwork21:37:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

unfortunately it's not

Alex M - clockwork21:37:53 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

but a neat concept

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)21:38:23 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Just tighter than the standard Bollinger values of course

Alex M - clockwork21:39:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we could do this based on calculated market price

Alex M - clockwork21:39:27 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

rather than on-chain

Alex M - clockwork21:39:47 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i trust witnesses to do it as long as we define the algorithm properly

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)21:40:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Using the current witness price

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)21:40:35 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Feed

Alex M - clockwork21:40:56 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i did actually do some research on similar ways to calculate expected discount/premiums based on traditional trading principles

Alex M - clockwork21:41:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

there's loads of stuff we can "calculate"

Alex M - clockwork21:41:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

as witnesses

Daniel Schwarz (liondani)21:41:28 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

We are slower than the market amd tha would be good for mssr rigjt?

Alex M - clockwork21:41:40 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

prior to providing feed/mcr/mssr etc

Alex M - clockwork21:41:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

putting it altogether is a largeish task though

Alex M - clockwork21:42:01 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

e.g.

Alex M - clockwork21:42:14 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I used principles defined here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volatility_risk_premium

Alex M - clockwork21:42:52 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

to calculate the "expected" premium/discount on bitUSD based on recent market volatility for BTS

Alex M - clockwork21:43:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

that could be used to define our threshold (ie...if premium falls within that range , it is expected and thus no need to adjust for it)

Alex M - clockwork21:43:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

your suggestion could help calculate appropriate MSSR

Alex M - clockwork21:43:39 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

etc.

Alex M - clockwork21:43:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

just have to put eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeverything together

Alex M - clockwork21:44:42 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

i think the solution is a bunch of things

Alex M - clockwork21:44:51 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

just need to hide teh complexity from the end user

Alex M - clockwork21:45:24 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we could combine a few concepts like this to set MCR/MSSR/Feed prices appropriately

Alex M - clockwork21:45:33 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

we could then improve force settlement mechanism

Alex M - clockwork21:45:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

then add collateral bidding prior to GS like i suggested in the forums

Alex M - clockwork21:46:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

then also add abit's bad debt holder idea

Alex M - clockwork21:46:44 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

which could have fees siphone off to it to ensure decent collateralisation

Alex M - clockwork21:46:45 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

etc.

Alex M - clockwork21:47:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

if we put everything together and HIDE it from the end user...i think we'd end up with somethign quite robust

Crypto Programmer21:49:19 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

hello everybody

Crypto Programmer21:49:25 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

I want to ask a question

Crypto Programmer21:49:31 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

how to fork bitshares and create own network?

Crypto Programmer21:49:32 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

thanks

Alfredo Garcia22:00:59 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

lol

Alfredo Garcia22:01:13 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

cryptoprogrammer

how to fork bitshares and create own network?

you can follow private testnet setups: https://github.com/bitshares/bitshares-core/wiki/private-testnet

Alfredo Garcia22:01:38 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

it is pretty close to your own network

Alfredo Garcia22:02:21 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

you first have a bitshares blockchain clone where you are fully in control, then start changing some stuff like the core token name and others so it start getting personalized

Kristin Low22:05:50 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

clockworkgr

if we put everything together and HIDE it from the end user...i think we'd end up with somethign quite robust

You just won the competition.

Crypto Kong22:09:16 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

Give the man his prize

Crypto Kong22:09:29 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

You did create the worker right alex?

Crypto Kong22:09:34 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

😂

Kristin Low22:21:22 - 27 Nov 2018 [UTC]

😂

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